Talk:Transphasic torpedo
Reverse engineering It's strange voyager writers chose to give starfleet this tehcnology. If such a torpedo is able to blow up a borg cube, it can also get rid of just about anything. Starfleet got some of these torps after endame, it seems obvious they will be reverse-enginered and fitted in all starfleet. with this weapon, Starfleet has no ennemy. Unless, of couse, the weapon can be countered. Trek is full of absolute wapon that end up to be useless, like the Breen's disabling beam. Too bad for Picard h had no reverse-engineered transphasic torpedo to use against the Scimitar ;-) --Rami :Amen! I tried to post a little note about how unreasonable these torpedos were in the main article, but it was deleted as too much personal opinion. I just find it really hard to believe Starfleet could have developed a weapon of this ridiculous power by the 2380s (just 3-12 years after VOY ). And you're right, if Starfleet does have some of these things, they will figure it out (it only would have taken them another 3-12 years anyway, and it'll go faster with some working torpedos to reverse-engineer) and then no one can oppose them. Way to cut off any possibilities for future stories by removing any possible (reasonable) threat. The Transphasic Torpedo was not actually developed by Starfleet, but rather the on it's longer road home in the alternate timeline shown in Endgame. There is nothing saying it's 'impossible' or 'impractical' for Voyager to create such a weapon. For all we know, they may have come upon a new ideal on their journey, or an inspiration came up. Additionally, the inclusion of Transphasic torpedoes does not cut off future stories. As the torpedo is future technology, I would surmise Starfleet wanted to investigate it and not take a huge strategic advantage. Voyager or the torpedoes themselves were probably taken to some compound for secret investigation to be used in the future when they would be deemed fit, this can be proven by the fact the USS Enterprise-E (Basically the strongest ship in the Federation fleet) in didn't use or seem to have any Transphasic torpedoes in which they would've been effective. There is also the probability that Starfleet was unable to figure out how to reverse-engineer it and are continuing work or waiting until the future to do so. Additionally, it didn't take long for Starfleet to develop the Quantum torpedo, a weapon for use against the Borg. They were despirate for a weapon, and they eventually developed one that would actually cause some major damage to Borg vessels. If the Voyager crew were despirate, and had received new means to make a weapon, the transphasic torpedo could easily be made within 12 or so years, even if development took 2+ years. - Adm. Enzo Aquarius 01:34, 7 Sep 2005 (UTC) ::There should be some note on the page. Even if it's just to point out the curiousness of them not being in the movie. Jaf 02:22, 7 Sep 2005 (UTC)Jaf I'm not sure the transphasc torpedoes are really more powerful. Because of the name, I tend to link it to the phase cloaking from Pegasus. The cloaking device was small, and was easy to fit to the enterprise. This is infortunately a trek cliché : revolutionnary technologies can be fitted to your good ol' starship in a matter of hours, not very realistic. With this device, the cloaked ship could pass trhough matter because it was "out of phase". That's how the Ent-D got out of the asteroid. We don't know whetherthis device also allow to go trhough forcefields/shields. If so, imagine a miniaturized version, designed to cloak a torpedo. You could cross the ennemy's shields and hull as if they were inexistant, and explode inside his ship. You don't need vmore power than a regular photon torpedo. In fact, a small regular bomb could be more than enough, if you can bring it directly into their command bridge, or near antimatter storage or plasma conduits! Janeway came with a shuttle, she couldn't bring several torpedoes with her. But she may have take several mini-phase-cloaking-devices, to convert existing photon torps into transphasic. It's also consistant with the vfx : it we look at the exploding borg cube, it really look like if the explosions came from inside. If so, perharps a simple change in the shield modulaytion or something could make hese torps useless. Remeber Dominion's polaron beam : seemed a absolute weapon at first, and once the shields were adapted, it was just another beam weapon. This may explain why we didn't see these weapons in Nemesis. Perhaprs the result after a study of thse weapns was : "with this, we could destroy any ennemy in one shot. But, one we've used it, ennemies could quickly adapt their shields.". Then the logical course of action is to keep those torps top-secret, stored in some starbase, to be use only in case of extreme danger, like 15 borg cubes running into Fderation core worlds. --Rami 11:23, 30 Nov 2005 (UTC) In that case, Rami, they are worthless against the Borg. In a few years, if the Borg attack again, presumably, they would have adapted to them. Perhaps they are being held as a weapon of last resort against any other foe (ex: Romulans, if the Dominion decided that it wanted to go back to war, or some new foe) - Chris. The transphasic torpedo in current(VOY) time With such a weapon you would think that Starfleet would be the strongest but you also have to remember Starfleet doesn't go for weapons of mass destructions. Such as Subspace weapons, Megaton Torpedos(VOY - one used against Species 8472, Nano Torpedos(that could be used in many ways), Genesis Device, etc. We have to remember Starfleet might have the technology to do a lot but they base heavily on morals and respect of peace. So for them to show these new weapons it would make it seem that Starfleet is no longer based on the concept of "Peace" but war. Now not to say that when need comes that they won't bring it out as a refit like Quantum Torpedos(which Cardasians had already). Like it was mentioned before Starfleet is usually based on a "need" bases. Not to mentionare you going to let all you possible enemy know how big you real guns are? I think not. It is always good to keep some on the side as a surprise tactic or absolute threat like the borg. This weapon can be counted as a weapon of mass destruction. If one torpedo can destroy and heavily shielded borg ship in a nebula like area imagine how easy it would be to fire one straight into the core of a planet not to mention a star. And from on of my favorite quotes of all time by Uncle Ben of Spiderman: "Remember,with great power,comes great responsibility." Theory on how the transphasic torpedoes work I recall a description of how transphasic torpedoes work going something like this: "The torpedoes have an interphase generator which places them slightly out of phase with normal matter. This allows them to penetrate conventional shields." I don't recall where I heard that, but it would certainly explain why the Borg had no defense against them; you can't adapt to something that passes through your shields as if they're not there. Where was it established that these are now in the hands of Starfleet? <><> As was said, the transphasic torpedoes were something Voyager developed in the unaltered timeline. And in the altered one, Voyager would have had them when they returned to Earth, so how would they have gotten into anybody else's hands? --Boct1584 I read on one of the Star Trek PBEM games that transphasic torpedoes analyze the shield frequency just before impact and modulate their transphasic cloaking device to match. However, they don't have time to transmit the shield frequency before impact. Too bad. --Skyler 15:29, 27 January 2007 (UTC) the Deep Space Nine Technical manual gives a description about a type of torpedo that was in development that detonates by, in essence, squeezing and twisting the fabric of space to the point of strain or even tearing, this description matches with the "Transphasic" portion the Torpedo's named after, and since the naming conventions of torpedoes generally refers to their detonation method, the book was written in 1998, and Engame first aired in 2001, even so, it is quite likely that the entry in the DS9 tech manual was from a torpedo concept that had been planning on having showcased, and that torpedo concept became the Transphasic. they gave the Photon torpedoes a yield in the range of 18.4 isotons (or approximately 46 megatons) while the Quantum Torpedoes a rating of 25 isotons (or 64 megatons). this is apparently due to the fact that the Photon torpedoes never quite reached that maximum theoretical limit they established when the Enterprise D was launched, where as the Quantums torpedoes do. the new type of torpedo is given a rating of 50 isotons, this may seem small when compared to the damage the borg cubes suffered but remember Borg cubes, when dealing with straight defense aren't really all that powerful and never were, just a few quantum torpedoes can destroy a cube utterly, and even 3 phaser blasts can chew 20% of the ship out in 3 large chunks as shown in Q who. The main thing that makes them powerful is that they can reduce the amount of damage their ships take, similar to the %age armour resists some video games. so a ship hits them with a 25 isoton blast, but they have adapted to that weaponry so they only take very small portion of that damage, however, if they take a direct 25 isoton hit that they have not adapted to, then a good portion of the ship could be destroyed, easily 50-76%. by the nature of Transphasics affecting space/time to get their 100 megaton/50 isoton blast, the Borg cannot adapt and thus take the full force of the hit. the ship is hit with a 50 isoton blast with only their conventional shields and armour to protect them, and we've seen 1 quantum torpedo destroy all but the toughest dominion ships, including breen cruisers. As a result, it deals the same amount of damage to the Borg as it would if it were a much more powerful, but adaptable weapon. Borg ships can deflect anywhere up to 90% of incoming damage once they have adapted fully, so a 50 isoton blast that they cannot adapt to is worth a 500 isoton blast that they can, since they would suffer the 50 isoton damage either way. Most likely Reason they are not in Nemesis Starfleet and the Federation constantly quote the Prime Directive and the Temporal Prime Directive. They know that the torpedoes are from the future and it would violate the temporal prime directive to use them. They were most likely destroyed to prevent anyone from using them. The armoured technology that Voyager had was most likely destroyed as well to prevent it from disturbing the time line. --Preator 09:55, 02 May 2007 :Which is already in the article. --OuroborosCobra talk 15:09, 2 May 2007 (UTC) Recent Edit Oops. Sorry. Rashly didn't see that there'd been so much heated discussion about such a short article, before going on and editing it. The edit, though, is pretty much a stylistic matter. There was too much info for a parenthetical (italicized main-body) passage, and it was kind of a mishmash of in- and out-of- universe stuff. I was just trying to clean it up, the gist of which should be pretty uncontroversial But there's a possibility I may have accidentally stepped on a few pinky toes here and there. Go ahead and make the adjustments; I won't feel hurt or anything. I just hope everyone thinks it's possible to do it by adjusting the new format. I think it's an improvement. 12:09, 22 June 2007 (UTC) Removed Text Removed the following: Post-Voyager – Saijen 23:36, 25 March 2008 (UTC) Through careful research, it's been found that after the return of Voyager, StarFleet formed a new treaty designated, "The Voyager Treaty", stating the following: 'This treaty will deal with Transphasic Torpedos only. It states that they can not be used against 'civilized' races. Meaning, neutral and allied species. They are designed to be anti-Borg, but if another power threatens the trillions of lives in the Alpha and Beta Quadrants, they can be used to save those lives. Examples would be Planet Killers (as seen in TOS), another Dominion invasion, Species 8472, and any other unforseen aggressors.' as pure speculation. I'm uncertain, but it sounds like fanon.--31dot 23:49, 25 March 2008 (UTC) Background speculation? I'm wondering if the specuation about why we didn't see the torpedoes again is getting to be a bit much. Another 'possible' reason was recently posted. What is considered to be an acceptable level of this? Personally, I think mentioning the TPD and the fact that it may be exclusively an anti-Borg weapon is sufficient, but I'm sure other people have their own ideas, so should any of it be there?--31dot 21:10, 29 April 2008 (UTC) :When the background section (1,205 characters) is larger than the main article (823 characters), I think that it could get cut down a little. I agree with 31dot that the TPD and anti-Borg statements could be kept. Maybe restructure it as a list instead of paragraph. Such as... :After their critical role in "Endgame," transphasic torpedoes were not shown or mention in . A number of in-universe explanations would be possible: :* The torpedoes may have been destroyed in light of the Temporal Prime Directive. :* The torpedoes may have been kept a secret from adversaries and their inclusion on the was not warranted. :* There may have been insufficient refit and construction time to include them on the USS Enterprise-E. :* Having been designed specifically to counter the Borg threat, their effectiveness against other vessels may have been limited. :* Given the name of the torpedoes, they may have been unstable in some way, thus preventing the Borg from being able to adapt. :Cut it down to 721 characters. Thoughts? ----[[User:Mainphramephreak| Willie]][[User Talk:Mainphramephreak| LLAP]] 21:23, 29 April 2008 (UTC) We need to come to some decision about what level of speculation we want here. Mainphrame has made a good effort to keep it to a minimum, but I wonder if it should just be limited to "They were not seen again after Nemesis. No explanation was provided."--31dot 21:35, 14 May 2008 (UTC) ::Yep. To me all this speculation is totally unnecessary. "Temporal Prime Directive prohibiting future tech" is a bit of a wierd idea, when they openly use the mobile emitter which is future tech. The fact that future timeships didn't swoop in to erase Janeways attempt indicates this whole deal was a paradox that belongs in the timeline. And as I understood it, it was only the transphasic tech of the shuttles weapon systems that was adapted to upgrade the torpedoes Voyager already had, not actual torpedoes provided to the Voyager. "Production dangers" seems far fetched, and the "no refit time", as what would they have to refit on the Ent-E? Voyager launched the torps from standard launchers, modified the weapons in what, a few days. Only plausible interpretation to me seems that they are specifically only effective against the whole Borg shield/hull etc. design as that is what was said in the episode by Seven regarding the shuttles tech: "Much of it appears to have been designed to defend against the Borg." Why do we need to speculate beyond that? --Pseudohuman 22:27, 14 May 2008 (UTC) ::: Unless those are production staff explanations, none of that so-called "background" should exist. --Alan 22:39, 14 May 2008 (UTC) Removed the various explanations. I didn't post a copy of them because there was already one here. Feel free to tinker with it(or even remove it all if even that much shouldn't be there)--31dot 22:48, 14 May 2008 (UTC) :::Here's a quote from Greater than the Sum on how they work: :::Seven of Nine - "The transphasic torpedoes work by delivering a subspace compression pulse existing in an assymetric superposition of phase states. If one subcomponent of the pulse is blocked by shielding, enough others will still succeed in penetrating to the target to ensure that the majority of the pulse is still delivered. Each torpedo's transphasic configuration is different, randomly generated by a dissonant feedback effect, so there is no way for the Borg to predict the configuration of its phase states in order to shield against them." :::Judgeking 09:35, 19 January 2009 (UTC) ::::Red Alert... incoming Treknobabble... brace for impact... reroute power from the fluma-fluma to the scooby dooby... --Robert T.F.S. Beltran16:26, 19 January 2009 (UTC) can a Transphasic torpedo destroy a Species 8472 bioship Are Transphasic torpedoes powerful enough to destroy a Sepcies 8472 bioship?.-- 20:06, 11 May 2009 (UTC) :Nobody knows. — Morder 20:07, 11 May 2009 (UTC) ::Can you stop asking these questions? If they haven't been seen, we can't answer. Chances are, something major like that would be in the article already. --OuroborosCobra talk 02:47, 14 May 2009 (UTC) Addendum; c. 2381 As of 2381, during the events of Destiny parts 1, 2 and 3 (official canon novels, as far as I'm aware), the Borg started incursions into Federation, Klingon, and Romulan space. Single cubes were being dispatched to individual planets and razing them. During this time, the Admiralty approved of ONLY the Enterprise setting up manufacturing resources in their cargo bays to make transphasic torpedoes for use against the Borg. When the Borg came through the Azure Nebula with over 7000 cubes, and literally steam-rolled over 400 ships from Romulan, Federation, Cardassian, Klingon and Breen (to name the mains), the Federation gave the blueprints for the transphasic torpedo out to their allies. Unfortunately, as the engagement grew VERY close to Earth, the Borg completed their final adaptations to the transphasic torpedo making it no longer useful. :Novels are apocrypha in MA, you can add a small note to the apocrypha section on this development. --Pseudohuman 08:54, January 17, 2010 (UTC) ''Star Trek'' Film 11 had a Federation starship in it, the , from after Nemesis, that wasn't shown or mentioned to be armed with transphasic torpedo weaponry. Thats why was mentioned in the article. The ship was after all in the same general ship type category as the Federation mission scoutship from Insurrection that was armed with phasers and photon torpedoes. --Pseudohuman 19:31, February 17, 2010 (UTC) Temporal paradox The ending of this episode should have created a major temporal paradox. The reason Admiral Janeway went back in time and developed the anti-Borg technology was because of Voyager's extended stay in the Delta quadrant. With Voyager's future history changed, how was the anti-Borg technology even invented in the first place? Or better yet, how was Janeway able to go back in time and change the past if the cause for making that trip never occured? -- 12:57, April 10, 2012 (UTC) :That's easy. A temporal inversion wave in the quantum matrix created a resonance frequency in the spacetime matrix. This naturally led to a cascading thermolytic pulse which permeated the neurolytic particle field in the area, as well as a gravitic flux inhibition effect. After that the plasma wake inevitably led to a temporal/quantum protection effect of all involved. Duh. -Angry Future Romulan 14:46, April 10, 2012 (UTC) ::A real serious answer would be: That at least according to the Borg Queen in "Endgame", in the case of this episode, if the Borg would have managed to kill prime-Captain Janeway, alt-Admiral Janeway and her incursion into the past would have been erased from the prime-timeline. In this unique time travel event it would seem that for some unknown reason both prime and alternate future versions of Janeway were essentially "causally linked" even though they were from different timelines. While it appears that this unique oddity was only added by the writers to add a new level of surprise suspense to the end of the episode, it is still canon, and we must simply accept it as part of how time travel sometimes works out in Star Trek. To do otherwise would be nitpicking. --Pseudohuman 23:27, April 10, 2012 (UTC) :::Janeway is from an alternate timeline and universe/reality, so the events she changed didn't change her past, only the other Janeway's future. Then again, it could just be that all time travel that changes events leads to a paradox, but because this is just entertainment, how changing time effects what the viewer sees is dictated by what the writers wanted to do, also known as the plot. See this for more info, start at 3:33. - 23:45, April 10, 2012 (UTC) ::The Borg Queen actually reveals at the end to Admiral Janeway: "Captain Janeway is about to die. If she has no future, you will never exist and nothing that you've done here today will happen." --Pseudohuman 23:55, April 10, 2012 (UTC) Possible solution for the Borg to adapt to transphasic torpedoes This is my very first blog in Memory alpha, so I hope you will appreciate this, but I was wondering about how Transphasic torpedoes work when I saw the dstrutive power on VOY episode "End Game". As mentioned ealier, transphasic torpedoes have "an interphase generator which places them slightly out of phase with normal matter. This allows them to penetrate conventional shields." Now, if you have seen the TNG series episode "The Next Phase", the episode actually gives us the solution on how to counter phased matter. the Romulans were experimenting with the exact same intephase generator and molecular phase inverters, which phased both Leutenant Commander Geordi La Forge and Ensign Ro Laren and cloacked at the same time due to the Romulan cloacking technology that was interconnected with the phase inverter. Later, Lieutenant Commander Data came up with the solution and answer to the mystery of Geordi and Ro's "deaths", they left chroniton fields when they moved around and Data recommended to use anyon sweeps to eliminate the chroniton particles generated ny the phase. In conclusion, can Anyon sweeps not be used by the Borg to adapt to and de-phase the Transphasic torpedoes to normal matter again for conventional shields to withstand and not penetrate the shields, like a photon and quantum torpedo? :That's pretty much all speculation. -Angry Future Romulan 20:38, February 19, 2013 (UTC) ::Nothing indicates transphasic torpedoes are in any way related to interphase technology. Article discussion pages aren't blogs for sharing fan speculation. In here we discuss how to improve articles. If you read the whole article, there has been an explanation in the licensed novels on how the torpedoes work. --Pseudohuman (talk) 22:24, February 19, 2013 (UTC) :::As Pseudohuman said, this isn't the forum to share fan speculation or theories. This also isn't a "blog"; please review the introduction page for information on what we are. 31dot (talk) 23:02, February 19, 2013 (UTC)